The stock finish is original and excellent. That way, were helping small businesses in Winchester ~ Model 12 Custom~ 12 GA Used Guns. But getting back to the original question, a Simmons rib does detract from the value of a Model 12 and most people will turn away from them. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. Thereafter, a staggering number of variations were produced during the 1912-1980 period. $899.97. Winchester made changes to the stock of the Model 12 duck gun after its introduction. Has a Cutz on the end of the barrel. As to price, it will also depend on gauge, barrel length, choke, barrel steel, wood type, pad vs. plate, etc. I worked in two gun shops when I was in college. the shot gun is in very good condition , with a 28 in ventilated rib barrel with full choke. The stock is the upgraded Monte Carlo style capped pistol grip, heavy pad, upgraded wood, and cheek rest. winchester model 12 heavy duck gun 30" simmons vent rib 1953 pre-64 rare 12 ga. magnum 3" edition proof marking - 12 gauge magnum - 5 - 30 " As you know that, Winchester Model 12 (factory original) 28-gauge pump action shotgun. This gives a wrinkled appearance on bottom of pistol grip and bottom of forend. All Rights Reserved, Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun 30" Simmons Vent Rib 1953 Pre 64 Rare 12 Ga. Magnum 3" Edition Proof Marking. Charles Askins was the leading expert on shotguns in the first half of the last century. becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. Thanks for the reference. Its failure to release on discharge made it impossible to shoot doubles [at skeet] with this particular sample. The staff concluded, Mechanically, the sample was not as good as other guns of the same model. Noted were machine marks on the breech bolt, wood not closely fitted, primers struck off center and sharp edges at the chamber. Item. I fired 10 patterns for each of the five test loads in each of the two duck guns, for a total of 100 patterns. I was glad to see this as I know for a fact that while many weren't done, they did indeed do some. No Reserve. I still have a few 2nd style action slides left. Johnson, at once one of the great gun designers and one of the least known, produced a steady flow of new firearm designs for Winchester. Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without The Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun Proved Itself a Shooter, Colt No Longer Exclusive Owner of M4 Rifle, Mossberg 940 Pro Turkey & Tactical Review: Shotgun Shangri-La, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Fossari CRX9 Sporting Over/Under, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Browning Citori High Grade 50th Anniversary, 8 On-Target Concealed Carry Insurance Options (2022), 10 Affordable Double-Barrel Shotgun Options (2022), Best AR-15 Options For Any Budget And Buyers Guide (2022), Best Concealed Carry Handguns For Women (2022). The load averaged 67.5% (range 62-72.5%), in a 30-inch circle at 40 yards. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. We'rebringing a level of This is a 12 GA pump shotgun manufactured in 1950. We get the FFL from your store others make you find it, copy it, and fax it. Nash Buckingham was one of the great duck-hunting writers of the period. The Model 12 shotgun, initially the Model 1912, hit the market in August 1912. Both shotguns shot to point of aim and all patterns were contained on the target paper due to precise aiming, facilitated by placing a 25-pound sack of lead shot between me and the gun butt. Most websites are poorly Rangemasters are here to answer all your questions about our products or process. Winchester cautiously claimed 70 to 75% pattern in a 30 inch circle at 40 yards.. Beautiful grain pattern and very tight hand checkering on the stock . The slide lock is automatically released by the forward nudge of recoil in the Model 12. The slide handle was given a larger diameter, flat bottom and 14 grooves on each side of the handle about 1947. Model 12 duck guns are highly specialized tools for a very limited number of duck hunters who can regularly center a duck at 40-60 yards, and need to. The steel has a nice patina and the stock has most of the lacquer worn off. only one I have ever seen unless TS member owns one? I hope this helps you out A forum community dedicated to Shotgun owners and enthusiasts including the Remington, Beretta, and Mossberg shotguns brands. Western brought out their Super-X 2-3/4 and 3-inch shotshells in 1921. Buckingham recorded his adventures in some of the best hunting stories ever written. This shotgun is in near new condition in the original box. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. There are 16 pages of loads for various shell lengths, shot sizes (dust through buck, soft or chilled), five powders, five shell grades and 11 gauges. This combination, which averaged 83.6% at 40 yards, averaged 44.2% at 60 yards! Simmons vent rib and custom AA+ walnut furniture. Learn how your comment data is processed. Numbers match on barrel and receiver. President Roosevelt signed the law limiting magazine repeaters to three shells for migratory game bird hunting in 1935. Winchester dutifully shipped its duck guns with a wooden plug installed to limit magazine capacity to two shells. WE DO NOT SHIP INTERNATIONALLY $40 Shipping. A great looking gun, in excellent condition. There is a moderate mark as shown in the photograph. An 80% pattern they felt should make it a real 60-yard outfit with No. Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge (W9229) Price: $3,250.00 Item Number: W9229 Previously sold Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge shotgun. The latest 2-pin rib gun researched has a serial number of 19114xx with a date of August 26th, 1960. He is engraving the old (Ulrich big duck 12-5 pattern) on it. "Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known." Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. IC CHOKED MIROKU MADE. MAKE OFFER. Instead of buying a gun thats No other pump shotgun feels like the duck gun. L.O.P. I sold 41 model 12's and 21's at a gun auction in Wichita Kansas to accommodate the move. BARREL 30" CHOKE FULL 90% FACTORY BLUE ORIGINAL FACTORY HEAVY DUCK RECOIL PAD WOOD VERY GOOD. . Nickel and ivory sight beads on the aftermarket Simmons rib, with choke marked full and 2 3/4 inch chamber. When it was. I have often wondered how well my guns would pattern with modern ammunition. Action works perfectly. The used value of a WINCHESTER MODEL 12 shotgun has fallen ($310.78) dollars over the past 12 months to a price of $447.25 . Winchester Model 12 16Ga Pump Shotgun 28" Excellent condition Made in 1939 Gun #: 903285649 Seller: JerArms GA Sales: 60 $872.00 Full Details More from this Seller 1 Image (s) Winston Churchill custom Winchester Model 12 Pigeon 20 gauge, gold relief, staggering wood, provenan. (no choke stamp on barrel). We join Buckingham in his ducking skiff as he is poled through the bayou by Ab, his black guide. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's My gun is a pump action Model 12 shotgun with a grooved slide handle (forearm). Most sellers have no idea what they are selling. The duck guns reputation was made with the one and five-eighths ounce load, the heaviest 12 magnum load from about 1935 to the mid-1950s. Bids. Actually, it is generally thought by researchers that no Winchester factory Model 12 ribs were made or installed by Simmons. Spend your time enjoying the gun you want, not getting frustrated with a complex website that makes gun buying hard. According to the Serial# 1439865, and Winchester manufacturing records, this gun w. 12ga, #366988, 30 inch barrel, 2 1/2 inch chamber, full choke, solid rib, blue finish, straight grip checkered walnut stock, checkered walnut forearm, 13 3/4 LOP with "newer" Winchester pad, 12ga, #1417110, 30 inch barrel, 3 inch chamber, full choke, blue finish, walnut stock and forearm, solid rib, original red rubber pad, 1954. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I believe the blueing to be original. Ernie special order model 12's from Winchester to add his Dounut Vent Rib. I included tungsten polymer shot because it is non-toxic to waterfowl and has the same density as lead. Riffle's excellent reference book on the Model 12 notes the 1919 patent date for the two-pin rib, but suggests that the rib was not on the market until 1920. A Simmons Rib has been added to the barrel and the metal was refinished. Winchester undertook preparations for improvements in its firearms line following World War II. Every once in a while a Model 12 comes through our club with a high Moneymaker rib like that. 30" Full choke barrel. Most books say they did not. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. The 30" vent rib barrel is very good with a bright shiny bo, This Winchester Model 12 in 12 Gauge is in good condition with moderate wear to the wood surfaces and light thinning of the bluing on the barrel. I believe that Stadt's book is one of the few that actually states that Winchester did produce M42s with Winchester vent ribs. MAKE OFFER. A Cold War era classic with smooth lines, a legendary back story, and an exotic-sounding name, Beretta's Model 71 was definitely a mouse that roared. I used to club trap targets with it. He worked with another Winchester researcher. Charles Askins is the father of the late Colonel Charles Askins, Jr., of course. No Reserve . It is general consensus that 10 patterns are required for an accurate appraisal of a given load and barrel combination. And for this reason the spike in prices for the forty two will go back down becouse there is a alternative that is for sure and safe and they know all the things that people look for to see if it came from the winchester factory. Model 42s with later ribs than the donut post, with no Simmons markings or with Simmons markings, and with proof marks in the proper places are thought to have had their ribs installed at Simmons and sent back to Winchester for marketing or marketed at Simmons. Notes - Delivery *Estimated delivery dates include seller's handling time, origin ZIP Code, destination ZIP Code and time of acceptance and will depend on shipping service selected and receipt of cleared payment. Regards Chuck. very accurate description and fast delivery, HOCH Reloading Single Cavity Mold c56 309170 .309 170gr nose pour NICE (#334593408927), Arrived quickly, well packaged, item is as described. Winchester ~ Model 12 Trap ~ Pump Action Shotgun ~ 12 Gauge. The old trap shooters didn't and they did just fine. Reduced bag limits and shell capacities for repeating shotguns were introduced. No. says Madis. Terms and Conditions and Privacy Policy. Although the quality of the rib will be the same as the original Winchester, the only way a Simmons rib looks OK on a Model 12 is if they DON'T put their silly name down the side of the rib. Possible the fore end has been either replaced or re done. Firearms dont get much more iconic than John Moses Brownings legendary Auto-5 semi-auto shotgun, affectionately called the Humpback for its distinctive drop at the rear of the receiver. Madis states Ventilated ribs were rarely offered on [duck] guns. However, The fact is a few duck guns were provided with these ribs. Dave Riffles book and the various catalogs I have indicate that the Winchester new ventilated rib was an option from about 1954 to 1959. The gun weighed 8 1/2 pounds with its 32-inch Full choke barrel. winchester model 12 description: for sale is a very nice vintage winchester model 12, 12ga ga shotgun. The Model 12, already 23 years old, was one of many successful designs by Thomas C. Johnson. Very good condition overall. on your local stores shelf, most retailers drop ship it from a warehouse in The slide handle of early duck guns was round with 18 circular grooves. Winchester needed to cut it's manufacturing costs and the milled vented rib was a costly proceedure. See pi, Winchester Model 12, 28 gauge SKEET pump action shotgun, circa 1955. If it's a 12 gauge, replacement factory butt stocks can be hard to come by. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. The slide handle was enlarged in about 1956 to a slightly extended beaver tail shape with 14 circular grooves. I wish I had them back! As good as the Brownings are, Ill just keep my Model 12s from New Haven. Ernie Simmons had a close relationship with Winchester & John Olin; if you find any NSSA ,ATA, Field & Stream and Sports Afield magazines pre-war and post war you'll find he sold plenty of Winchesters out of his gun shop and attended many shoots selling target guns. Some late duck guns came with special order Hydro-Coil stocks, according to Madis. 12 Gauge, This is a very nice Winchester Model 12 Trap pump action shotgun in 12 gauge. The price in 1963 was $122 compared to $109.50 for the standard Model 12. another state. The Winchester Model 1912 (also commonly known as the Model 12, or M12) is an internal-hammer pump-action shotgun with an external tube magazine. Winchester Pre War Mod 12 Trap 2 Barrel Set 12ga, Winchester Pre 64 Mod 12 DU Illinios No.1 Engraved by M Dubber, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 HEAVY DUCK 12GA 3 INCH MAGNUM, Winchester Model 12 16 Gauge rare 2-barrel set, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, Winchester Mod 12 Vent Rib B-Carved Wood 12ga, "Winchester Model 12 Shotgun 12 Gauge (W12258), Winchester, Ducks Unlimited, Model 12, 12 Ga, Shotgun, Winchester Model 21 Heavy Duck, 12ga, 30" 3" mag, Briley Chokes, Winchester Model 12 12 ga. Deluxe Skeet grade w/ factory Cutts, Winchester Model 1912 Nickel Steel 20 gauge 24" VR bbl EARLY Serial #. It has a Simmons rib, which is not out of the question for Winchester to have used according to Maddis in his book of the model 12's. The metal finish is superior to a field grade gun, higher polish and a matted receiver top and magazine tube. Copyright 1995-2023 eBay Inc. All Rights Reserved. The nearest thing to a Model Twelve that could appear, whether domestic or foreign, would be a shotgun with the same model designation, but it would not and could not be a Model Twelve. Browning, in fact, did import foreign-made copies of the Model 12 after Madis wrote the above. When winchester changed the chamber to 3" did they mark the barrels or reproof? The era of plentiful ducks and liberal bag limits was also ending. Must ship to an FFL. Model 12 Skeet Pump Shotgun. Will Winchester ever build the Model 12 again? I decided to test the patterning of the five loads detailed in the accompanying table. service to the online gun buying experience that is unheard of. The earliest Simmons catalog I ever found was 1949 when Ernie began advertising his "Special vent rib" which was the "Dounut Post". The original "Old milled rib" was developed by Winchester in the 1920's- but like so many of the older quality features, post WW11 competition by Remington and Ithaca made Olin-Winchester more "cost concerned"-- Many Model 12's were equipped with Simmons ribs afterwards, some were sent to New Haven by Simmons, and some Model 12's (and others . Stay in the know. Lay-a-way available for t, Excellent overall condition sporting original finishes. Buckingham had a solid 60-yard duck gun and was on his way to becoming a legend. The Gun and the Times The Model 12 duck gun examined by the staff of the American Rifleman in 1936 was the earliest version. A 2pin vent rib lets the shooter sight under the bird and keep the bird in sight. Winchester recognized the scarcity of ducks in their promotional advertisement of the new duck gun To Meet the New Wildfowling Conditions. I suspect most Model 12 duck guns bought before World War II were put to work on other game. The Olins were businessmen first and duck hunters second. His handload was a .heavy load of Herco powder and 2 ounces of shot, either 2s or 4s. Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known. Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. Lot 6593: Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Vent RibAuction Date: February 17, 2023. Winchester proof steel is chrome-molybdenum steel. Contact us if you need an add on vent rib for your shotgun or order your Simmons ventilated rib barrel today! 14" LOP OVER THE ORIGINAL W, Up for sale I have a 100% NIB Winchester model 12 chambered in 16ga. And our The marsh is in riot! Model 12 was offered in several different styles: 1. Did they actually produce any in 1919 or did it take some time to get them out to the public after patent was approved? The rib wasn't offered until 1954 according to the Dave Riffle Model 12 book so it wasn't originally produced at the Winchester Factory. The takedown joints are tight (See the instructions in Madis book if your Model 12 has a loose take-down joint). Some will even go 85% to 90%, but rarely. Keith, who obtained Askins Ithaca 10 magnum double upon Askins death, achieved 93% patterns with two ounces of copper-plated#3 shot in the big double. Serial numbers match on barrel and receiver. Factory original Model 12s with round post ribs were made by Winchester, not Simmons. I don't believe their ever was a royalty, actually Simmons kept selling his special vent rib model 12's after the 1955 introduction of the Winchester Special Vent Rib @ New Haven. 30 Barrel. There was no need to shoot ducks at 60 yards. Patterns were fired from a benchrest, using American Target Company B21 silhouette targets measuring 35 by 45 inches. This gun is in excellent condition and has very desireable solid rib barrel with full choke. I recently acquired a 1921 gun. Franklin W. Olin founded Western Cartridge Company in 1898. From its debut until the end of the 1950's, the Winchester Model 1912 was the pump shotgun, long known as "the perfect repeater." This is why they were rust blued instead of hot blued. Severe drought conditions gripped the United States and Canada during the 1930s. The price $379 does not seem out of line for model 12's in this area; however, my question is does the Simmons rib add or detract from the value of the gun? Two birds tumble all awry from among the leaders. be complicated. Charles Askins, in an article entitled Long Range Shotguns in the January 1930 issue of the American Rifleman, concludes that a 12-gauge magnum with 1 3/8-ounces of shot, patterning 80% or better is pretty reliable [on ducks] at 65 yards. However, Askins goes on to say I have never, personally, had a shotgun which would reach far enough. Before the eight gauge was banned in 1918, Askins had a Greener eight-gauge double with 36-inch barrels weighing 13 pounds. I have several 2-pin guns. Chamber marked 2 3/4", choke marked full, and 14" LOP. Beautifully figured wood is solid with only light handling marks and marks on bo, This Winchester Model 12 started life in 1924 and has been customized by unknown individual at some point. An offset proof mark will boost the value compared to an aftermarket rib. A forum community dedicated to Trap shooting enthusiasts. Every cowboy needs a revolver. Tommy, I would be interested in one of the guns you describe. Westerns innovation was progressive-burning powder that deformed fewer shot during acceleration. Length of pull was reduced in January 1936 to reflect the extra clothing worn by duck hunters. Built from 1912 to 1963. When I dress Western, nothing beats the classic good looks of my Smith & Wesson (S&W) 586 .357 revolver. Askins and Buckingham would sure be surprised at how far the 12 magnum has come. SN 1231992 Up for sale is a very clean and unique Winchester Model 12 in Pigeon Grade. Ernie special order model 12's from Winchester to add his Dounut Vent Rib. Johnson designed the Models 52 and 61 rimfire rifles and the Model 54 centerfire rifle. In 1960, length of pull was increased to 13-3/4 inches on duck guns. Manufactured in 1962.

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